[Movie] LOTR: Return of the King ***SPOILERS*** [Archive]

Jess

12-18-2003, 04:23 AM

Okay okay I haven't seen the movie yet, (I can't even put in words how BADLY I want to see it, but I'm waiting until Friday to go with friends, I wanted to go at the midnight showing but I was sick and I had a test and jfeiaowfjoewajf) but seeing as how it opened today in most places, December 17th, people are bound to eventually want to talk about every single second in the film if they've seen it.

For those of you who don't know (how could you not?!?!?!) this is the third, FINAL installment of the Lord of the Rings trilogy, brilliantly directed by the amazing Peter Jackson and starring actors Elijah Wood (Frodo), Sean Astin (Sam), Orlando Bloom (Legolas), Ian McKellen (Gandalf), Viggo Mortensen (Aragorn), Liv Tyler (Arwen), Hugo Weaving (Elrond), Billy Boyd & Dominic Monaghan (Pippin and Merry), John Rhys-Davies (Gimli, and he does the voice of TREEBEARD!!!)... yeah I can go on but I'll stop there. The first film (The Fellowship of the Ring) was released two years ago, on December 19th, and the second (The Two Towers) one year directly after that. And after another year of waiting, Return of the King has FINALLY been released. If you're one of those "OHH LOTR is stupid, it's for the geeky weirdos that are.. nerdlings" then I insist on you PMing me, we can "work things out" :shifty:

The reason why I created this thread was because there's a lot of excitement going on in this (http://jay-chou.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=6469) thread, but many people have made it clear that they don't want to know what happens in ROTK until they've seen it. Meaning, NO SPOILERS. So don't even think about posting your thoughts on the movie containing spoilers in that thread or the rabid fans will eat your face.

Post all spoilers about the movie here.

That said... now I can't touch this thread until Friday :tongue:

ker_ai_teresa

12-18-2003, 12:10 PM

bring it on all those who have seen it! :excited: i don't mind spoilers when it comes to this particular film....and since i must wait until the 26th to see it here in sydney, then i might as well know if there are any surprises or alterations from the book.... :happy:

Mike

12-19-2003, 01:59 AM

I saw it yesterday... it was great. I highly recommend it to anyone that's interested, but make sure you either have read the books or have seen the first two because it picks off right where Two Towers left you off. They screwed up the ending but it's still pretty bood.

ashley

12-19-2003, 03:22 AM

I haven't watched it either and it's a shame that Mike didn't give out any spoilers.

Anyway, I read from the local papers that it has 12 alternative endings? Is that true? :excited:

I'm looking forward most to see how Aragorn will deal with Eowyn and Arwen. And I think that's a certain elephant scene that Legolas is in that I'm supposed to watch our for.

Jess

12-19-2003, 04:23 AM

ash> I think the scene with Legolas (I've heard a lot about it) is the oliphant scene. He's supposed to do some wicked amazing fighting scenes in the oliphant battle... and I've seen some screenshots. Gotta watch out for that :excited: and about the 12 alternative endings, I heard the screen fades to black many times near the end, and so you think the movie is over, but then another scene starts up again. So that might be what they're talking about.

Mike> How did they mess up the ending?? I heard they don't show the scouring of the shire... which is depressing.. because that's one of the best parts of the book. They claim that you can KINDA see the scouring when Frodo looks in Galadriel's bowl at Lothlorien, and he has the vision of the shire burning and the hobbits in chains, but... that doesn't do it justice.

vinka

12-19-2003, 05:27 AM

I heard the screen fades to black many times near the end, and so you think the movie is over, but then another scene starts up again. So that might be what they're talking about.

Seriously?!!?!?!? Does it mean I missed out on the 12 endings? I was wondering what they meant by 12 endings. I thought they were inlcuding those as extras in the DVDs when it comes out.
But then again, the screen did fade to black a few times but at the very last it said THE END so we left the theater. Please don't tell me I have to sit through 3.5 hrs again so that I can see the other endings. :crazy:

The Legolas scene was really really cool!!! He single handedly brings down a mastadon with dozens of orcs/sauron's army on it.......Gosh, he is so gorgeous. Orlando Bloom is just too pretty!! :bleh:
It was a great movie. But the anti-climax after they destroyed the ring is a bit of a drag though. I felt like everyone was moving in slow motion and I was like, "come on, move faster.....can we just get to the end of this, please?"

I didn't read the whole 3rd book so I didn't know how the ending is supposed to be. Gonna read the book when I have time later.
Overall, this movie kicks ass!!! They have some funny moments too. I love it.

spideysam

12-19-2003, 05:36 AM

I had the whole 3 parts of the lotr.... it is quite complicating cause the words are of high standard...... The Lord of the rings is the best fantasy story ever created.....
I give them a 5star

Phyxius

12-19-2003, 09:43 AM

Argh! Wat am i doing here?!!? Not meant to be watching the spoilers... Havent seen the movie yet, but i cant resisit!!!! Should leave soon...

ker_ai_teresa

12-19-2003, 09:50 AM

for those who have watched it, please explain what happened in the end. i'm curious why Mike thought the ending was spoilt... :? or was this just his opinion? did they follow the book?

zhy378

12-20-2003, 06:01 PM

hmm...even though i still havent finish reading the book so i don't know if is the same. but anyway i know few stuff from my firends who watched the movie this week. well, i think someone die,i don't remember much, but i think it was golum who died by fallin off a cliff and someone else i don't remember. then inthe movie Samwise have two kids named frodo and aragon while in book he have twelve kids. okay that's all i know but not sure if it is right. :dry: :wink2:

Mike

12-20-2003, 06:44 PM

Hm... 12 endings? What does that mean? That different movie theaters are playing different endings? i don't get it.

i just meant that if they were going to just cut 50 pages out of the end (the riots, etc.) then they should have just ended the movie earlier. They made the movie seem like they were trying to end the thing, but didn't know how.

But it's still a great movie... Yes, the scene with Legolas and the oliphants was really cool. He took one all by himself. Great.

Jess

12-21-2003, 02:52 AM

Okay, this movie was amazing. I probably won't talk about every single aspect right now because I would basically be retelling the entire movie, but...

This is by far the saddest of the three. It's the most emotionally moving, the most powerful, the final ending to the most breathtaking trilogy of our lifetime. I cried many times in the movie, which is a lot considering the only other movie I've ever cried in was Revolutions, and really.. if there was a movie to cry in, this would be it.

The relationship shown between Frodo and Sam is so touching and it really says something. Sam is willing to give up so much just for Frodo, and you can really see that in this film. There are times where your heart just breaks watching Sam on screen, like when he begins crying. Gollum manages to poison Frodo against Sam, the ring working to Gollum's advantage, causing Frodo to act and say things he wouldn't consider saying if he was in his right mind. Frodo is led to believe that all Sam is really trying to do is to take the ring from Frodo.. and so he orders his gardener, his companion to go home. Sam insists, through tears, that Frodo didn't mean it, that he didn't know what he was saying... and Frodo just coldly repeats that he has no more use for him, and that he should go home. And then he turns and leaves Sam, the hobbit that had gone through so much just to support his master, sacrificing his rations of food, suffering with thirst just so Frodo could get that extra few drops of water to continue on the journey, constantly lifting up his spirits when he barely had enough energy to walk... Frodo just leaves Sam alone, sobbing on the rock, and climbs the rest of the way with Gollum to Shelob's Lair.

The film begins with a flashback showing how Gollum came to be, and how Smeagol strangled his best friend on his birthday to have the ring in his possession, showing how powerful the ring was and what it could do to control you. It then shows how Smeagol gradually changed in both apperance, voice, and personality to become Gollum, soon forgetting his own name, being cast out and shunned from his family and being labelled "murderer" for killing his friend. This sets the grim tone that dominates most of the film..

You learn to hate Gollum in ROTK. Everything he does to manipulate Frodo, everything he does to try to get the ring within his own grasp. There is less and less of Smeagol, and you watch as Gollum envelops any good that was left in the creature. All the feelings of sorrow and pity you had felt for Smeagol/Gollum in the second film are basically swept away as you see Gollum throwing down Sam and sending Frodo tumbling, and crushing any hope of the destroyal of the ring. But to do all this, Andy Serkis had to pull off the voice perfectly, the emotion mixed in with the voice and the CGI to be able to turn the audience's feelings around completely. And he did, he managed, because he is amazing. "Smeagol was a human being clearly fallen from grace, whose submission to evil was not entirely complete, and who from time to time, displayed all too human traits demanding the audience's pity; a reminder of our own vulnerability."

Aragorn was, as usual, absolutely brilliant. He changed from being the ranger Strider, seen in Fellowship of the Ring, to the noble king of Gondor, leading the battle against Middle Earth. Viggo Mortensen acted extremely well and every time he came on screen you could feel a sense of confidence, that Aragorn wouldn't let any of them down.

And then Legolas and Gimli. The scene that everyone talked about with Legolas is the oliphant scene. He, Aragorn, and Gimli ride in to join the war, followed by the undead that had lived in the mountains, there to fulfill an oath that was broken years before (Aragorn had travelled through the Path of the Dead to ask them for their aid), and Legolas and Gimli make another bet to see who would kill the most amount before splitting. Legolas single-handed

ly brings down an entire oliphant, along with all the men riding on it, which is very amazing. And then there's Gimli's (funny as always) indignant cry, "That only counts as one!!!" It was kinda disappointing in a way, Legolas and Gimli both had really little screentime, which is sad because they had been such main, important characters before. But I guess it makes sense because this final chapter was mainly based around "return of the king" (Aragorn) and Sam and Frodo. Hopefully there will be more of them in the extended version (I'm already waiting for that to come out, and it's three days after ROTK was released in theaters).

Pippin has a huge role in the movie. You can really see how he has matured. After accidentally looking into Saruman's palintir and almost speaking directly with Sauron, he is taken with Gandalf to Gondor to try to rally them, since the orcs of Sauron were marching towards them to bring down the White City of Minis Tirith. He offers his service to Denethor, the steward/lord of Gondor (he believes himself to be the king, but he isn't, only merely watching over Gondor until Aragorn reclaimed his throne). It is sad to see him and Merry have to part, and it's a great feeling when you see them together again, when Pippin finds Merry wounded on the battlefield.. "I'll watch over you Merry.."

One thing that left me confused was why they didn't show Saruman's death. I know I'm probably not the only one in the movie theater that was wondering what happened to Saruman. All that happened was a one-minute scene in Isengard, with Gandalf saying that Saruman would not bother them anymore. But why didn't they show how Saruman died? Or Wormtongue? Even though they weren't going to affect the plot anymore, they can't be left just drifiting. Maybe the Extended edition will show the scene that they had left out.

There's so much more to mention but my post is too long already. Finally, I'll just mention the ending.

To me, the ending was perfect in the sense that Peter Jackson stayed true to the ending Tolkien had set -- Sam returns to his home in the Shire, with his love and wife Rosie Cotton, his hobbit children laughing and running to him, and Sam walking through the gates to his home and saying, "Well... I'm back." The scene before then when Frodo chose to leave to the Grey Havens with Bilbo and Gandalf, leaving behind his friends was really sad. Watching him hug Pippin, Merry, and Sam one last time, each of them crying, Frodo trying to smile since he knew this was what his fate was, but shedding tears of his own when he finally hugged Sam. In a way, Frodo decided to leave so Sam could lead his own life... during the final scene where Sam returns home, Frodo's voice says in the background that now, Sam could finally lead one life, and didn't have to feel split between two different lives.. one of serving Frodo, and the other of raising his children.

A reason why many didn't like this ending was because, like Mike said, they basically cut out 50 pages of the book, with the scouring of the Shire. They didn't write in any of the battles that the Shire had when the four hobbits returned to Hobbiton, the strange shift of lifestyle that they recognized when they met all of their old friends. However, according to screenwriter Philippa Boyens, "Unfortunately, as wonderful and brilliant as that last chapter is, it's not something we believe our film could sustain. You can't have a huge climax that your main characters have been striving for, for three films, and then start the story up again and play out an episodic ending. An audience sitting in the cinema just wouldn't go for it." You can't really argue with that.. I guess we'll all just have to wait until the Extended edition to see what they cut out, until we make any decisions on what they left out in the movie.

All in all, I'd give this movie like fifty stars. And about 10000/10. It was more than worth seeing, and is definitely what I would call "the best movie in the world." I personally like

it over the other two movies, even though a few other people (including my sister) claimed that the Two Towers had been better. But you can't really say that one was really "better" than the other in the first place, because you know that they were all good, and they all make up the entire picture -- the trilogy of the millenium. I don't think the Lord of the Rings will ever find it's equal.

pop

12-21-2003, 06:52 AM

wow what a synopsis u gave for the movie, jess!

i watched it and was equally impressed as jess
this is as high standard as the previous episode, if not better

actually about the end of sauron, when i read the book, i personally thought it was an anti-climax...the ring dropped into the cracks of doom and sauron is defeated..
*sigh* i was hoping for at least a final battle between aragorn and sauron when sauron finally obtained the ring...well maybe i was hoping too much..

one question bobbing in my head, has aragorn ever defeated a powerful enemy?
did he kill the cheif orc who killed boromir? pardon me for my forgetfullness...but as far as i can remember i see no great enemy beaten by aragorn which is ironic..
his wisdom and bravery is all that matters in this trilogy...but relatively he's useless in battle

1)we watched arwen 'flushed' off the black riders horses by summoning a water force, permanently destroying the first 'transport' of the nine kings

2)we watched legolas defeating the giant troll in the mines of moria and that oliphant in ROTK

3)we watched gandalf triumph over his fiery battle with the balrog of morgoth

best and most shocking is in ROTK
4)samwise gamgee, a hobbit fending off Shelob, the giant spider-like creature!!
and
5)eowyn, a royal princess chopped off the head of a nazhgul(is that the way to spell it?) and destroyed one of the most-feared nine kings!!

with this examples, get wat i mean? that is why i was hoping that aragorn will have a final battle with sauron to show that he is indeed a great fighter..*sigh*

lastly, when i was watching the credits rolled, something funny happened..
when the actor's name for boromir appeared 'sean bean', i heard a small gurl at the back of me pronounced it as 'sin bin'..i chuckled at the remark thinking to myself "it's 'shawn', not 'sin'"
then something else occured in my mind, if 'sean' is pronounced as 'shawn' then what about 'bean'? is it pronounced as 'bhawn'? then boromir is 'shawn bhawn'?? haha
that totally hit my laughing point and send me to a loud laugh, totalling forgetting the girl behind me...

ker_ai_teresa

12-21-2003, 12:30 PM

thanx for the summary Jess!

hmm....about Saruman....my memory is failing me, but i thought the book didn't talk about him and wormtongue's death??? didn't Gandalf, Frodo and the others meet him in the forest, but Gandalf let him go? or did he die later? i can't remem...

about Aragorn...i can sort of see what you mean pop. however, i think Aragorn is portrayed as a hero more in the sense that he is a leader with great leadership qualities which qualifies him as a king. he does engage in battles and is a military man as kings are back in those days. as a king he's got to be able to lead his men wisely and bravely or else they'll just be led to their deaths, and to me, that's how he has been portrayed.

as for a battle with Sauron, well, the book doesn't include that. plus, in the end, Frodo is meant to have the responsibilty of destroying the ring and hence Sauron. it does seem kinda like something is missing, but that's the way the story is. and anyway, i don't think Sauron actually had a physical body....after he was first defeated and the ring taken from him, it doesn't seem like he existed as a person with a body....he was shown as just an eye....

catseyes

12-21-2003, 06:09 PM

I had just watched the movie yesterday, it was captivating right from the start. I think Jess has mentioned more or less the summary of the 3rd installment already.

I am very impressed with Eowyn throughout the entire movie. She accepts Aragorn’s rejection without hatred. I am glad that she finally found happiness with Faramir. During the battle, she took down an oilphant down too. She single-handedly, slays a Nazgûl and then with the help of Merry, finishes off one of the Witch Kings in order to protect King Theoden. Got to love that part when the Witch King said, ”No man shall kill (or defeat?) me” and then that goes the reply “I am no man”. :thumbsup:

What puzzles me is why is Merry still lying in the battlefield after the battle. I remember he fainted after giving the Witch King a back stab and he should be relatively near Eowyn. But then again, without that, It’s pretty impossible for a scene with just Pippin and Merry conversing alone.

I was very upset with Denethor, the Steward. He did nothing for Gondor even though he knew that the Orcs are already advancing! :-x And he's insane, didn't bother to check if Faramir is still alive and wanted to cremate him together with his own self. Of course, i hate the way he practice favouritism towards Boromir over Faramir.

Of course, there are more interesting parts in the movie which I am unable to recall now. I will add on to them if I think of anything. :happy:

pop

12-22-2003, 08:34 AM

anyway, i don't think Sauron actually had a physical body....after he was first defeated and the ring taken from him, it doesn't seem like he existed as a person with a body....he was shown as just an eye....
yeap that's the truth of sauron..just a kind of soul wihout proper physical body

What puzzles me is why is Merry still lying in the battlefield after the battle. I remember he fainted after giving the Witch King a back stab and he should be relatively near Eowyn. But then again, without that, It’s pretty impossible for a scene with just Pippin and Merry conversing alone.
haha that is one movie mistake you caught!
i realized that too when eowyn destroyed the witch king, merry wasn't there with eowyn to cry with her for her father's death... :laughing:
he just totally...vanished from the scene!

for more info about movie mistakes, visit this website
www.moviemistakes.com

sabriel

12-22-2003, 08:44 AM

I am very impressed with Eowyn throughout the entire movie. She accepts Aragorn’s rejection without hatred. I am glad that she finally found happiness with Faramir. During the battle, she took down an oilphant down too. She single-handedly, slays a Nazgûl and then with the help of Merry, finishes off one of the Witch Kings in order to protect King Theoden. Got to love that part when the Witch King said, ”No man shall kill (or defeat?) me” and then that goes the reply “I am no man”. :thumbsup:

I was very upset with Denethor, the Steward. He did nothing for Gondor even though he knew that the Orcs are already advancing! :-x And he's insane, didn't bother to check if Faramir is still alive and wanted to cremate him together with his own self. Of course, i hate the way he practice favouritism towards Boromir over Faramir.

Of course, there are more interesting parts in the movie which I am unable to recall now. I will add on to them if I think of anything. :happy:

i JUST saw LOTR3
i'm so happy for eowyn too! gah. go girl power! so sad about the unrequited love tho. sigh*
(not word for word)
argon: why did you come?
Eowyn: you must kno how i feel?
(silence)
Argon: you love but a shadow of a man.
wahhh!!! he's soo cool! even when he's breaking your heart. wahhh!! :love:

stupid steward guy! gah. i have nothing against stupid ppl but only selfish ones must die! he deserved when gandolf whacked him in the face with his staff. :dry:

lol one of my fav parts is finding out gandalf sleeping with his eyes open and talking in his sleep. amazing.

and the ending...i admit my butt was a bit sore and they did stretch out some parts a bit. and fading and back part was irritating some ppl. one guy was trying to leave but they kept showing something else. and another person was trying to initiate some applause, failed three times.

but this movies is a great.

en_en

12-22-2003, 09:16 PM

I saw the movie yesterday...i really really loved it.

Especially when Frodo refused to drop the ring, i half expected/wish that Sam just push him in. thats mean i know, but after all theyve been through.

GaryDAI

12-24-2003, 02:51 AM

I just saw ROTK today! This is the greatest movie I have ever seen :excited: I teared up atleast 8 times and it would have been more if I was alone in the theater :cry:

Favorite moments:
1. Theoden's speech was brilliant. I had goosebumps during that whole scene.
2. At the end when Aragon kneeled down to the hobbits. The rest of Gondor followed suit :cry:
3. Eowyn. The witchking scene completely won me over. She was brilliant in it and I fell in love with her character.

I hate when people talk so I usually go in the whee hours of the morning. Today I went for the 9am showing. To my delight, only 10 people were in the theater! They were all quiet, although one couple brought their baby......She was crying near the end which pissed me off.

One thing that left me confused was why they didn't show Saruman's death. I know I'm probably not the only one in the movie theater that was wondering what happened to Saruman. All that happened was a one-minute scene in Isengard, with Gandalf saying that Saruman would not bother them anymore. But why didn't they show how Saruman died? Or Wormtongue? Even though they weren't going to affect the plot anymore, they can't be left just drifiting. Maybe the Extended edition will show the scene that they had left out.

It will definitely be on the extended edition. I heard a rumor that it could be as long as 5 hours! The more LOTR, the better :excited:

The reason it was cut out was because of the running time. It's a business so they couldn't leave the movie that long. It's already long as is, for the regular fans. Die-hard fans want it to go on forever :) Like me

Phyxius

12-24-2003, 03:12 AM

Hmm... I think The Two Towers was the best, because i loved the battle at Helms Deep.

But I think the main reason why ppl would think ROTK is best is because it ended as a happy ending. Frodo distroyed the ring, no more evil, everyone happy. Arwen and King Aragorn together yada yada... I didn't quite expect the happy ending, as i thought LOTR is one of those films that doesnt have an ending like the Matrix.

But its really sad when Gollum bit off Frodos fingers. I was like f*** u Smeagol!
I loved the part when Aragorn was king of Gondor and went to find the ghost to fight for them. The ghost was so cool! They are green!
I hated the part when Frodo and Sam was at Mordor! It's so green, dark and loud! It looked so scary! Also Shelob the spider... Doesnt even look like a spider... and the web on Frodo...Ergh!
The part where i found misleading was why did Denethor (ex-King of Gondor) wanted to burn Faramir and wouldnt trust Pippin that he was alive?!? Weird guy, but it was funny when he jumped off the cliff thingy wrapped in fire! I cracked up.

I found a website which had the bloopers of ROTK http://www.moviemistakes.com/film2746.
One of the bloopers that's pretty obvious is when Aragorn was lifting up the rider's spirits and stuff he was on the horse. But when they started the battle, he ran off first on his feet. In the background you can see the riders all standing on the ground. Where did the horses go?

GaryDAI

12-24-2003, 03:38 AM

Did anyone make it through the movie without going to the restroom? :laughing: I didn't buy any drink or popcorn. Mainly because the drinks make me have to go pee everytime.

Oh and yes, I sat through the whole movie without going! I'm really proud of myself :laughing:

But I think the main reason why ppl would think ROTK is best is because it ended as a happy ending. Frodo distroyed the ring, no more evil, everyone happy. Arwen and King Aragorn together yada yada... I didn't quite expect the happy ending, as i thought LOTR is one of those films that doesnt have an ending like the Matrix.
LOTR better have an ending........The Matrix was hated by many people for having such a horrible ending (on top of it's pointless 2 sequels).

The part where i found misleading was why did Denethor (ex-King of Gondor) wanted to burn Faramir and wouldnt trust Pippin that he was alive?!? Weird guy, but it was funny when he jumped off the cliff thingy wrapped in fire! I cracked up.
Denethor wanted Faramir dead. He knew that he was alive but was corrupted. I believe he had one of the palantirs too?

I found a website which had the bloopers of ROTK http://www.moviemistakes.com/film2746.
One of the bloopers that's pretty obvious is when Aragorn was lifting up the rider's spirits and stuff he was on the horse. But when they started the battle, he ran off first on his feet. In the background you can see the riders all standing on the ground. Where did the horses go?
I think it's because of editing. I think a little later on in that scene, one of the orcs toss a mithril shirt to the ground. Sort of a claim that Frodo is dead? That's why aragon said "for frodo" or something like that. I have to watch the movie again.

michelle_chou

12-24-2003, 03:50 AM

i didnt see it yet but im gonna go tomorrow with my friend! YAYAYAYAYAYAY! i finally get to see it!!!

Phyxius

12-25-2003, 10:18 AM

hmmm..... there's another part which i dun get? Why does Frodo leave at the end? Where is he going???

Donny

12-25-2003, 10:24 AM

to a new adverture!!! he was invited by the elf.

Phyxius

12-25-2003, 10:29 AM

I thought he gone heal or something... Coz didn't he say that the something is still haunting him and he hasnt recovered...?

GaryDAI

12-25-2003, 09:48 PM

The burden of him carrying the ring will never go away. The wound that he got from the first movie never fully healed either. The boat was basically going to heaven where they will live in peace.

Sam settles down with his family. Later on though his wife dies of natural causes (I think). His kids were all grown up so he went on the boat. He carried the ring too for a brief time, so it still haunts him a little.

ker_ai_teresa

12-26-2003, 04:00 AM

many of the elves including Galadriel and Elrond went with Frodo and Bilbo to the Grey Havens. i guess you can think of it as another world separate from that of middle-earth.

i'm not sure whether Sam eventually goes to the Grey Havens as well because the book doesn't mention this.

Phyxius

12-26-2003, 05:17 AM

Hey GaryD, the part of Sam going to the Heaven is from the book??!? Then why does k.a.t say it's not?!?

Angels on clouds

12-26-2003, 06:22 AM

I juz caught it yesterday...not bad, but wasn't as good as the 1st 2...mabbe becoz it was more of wrapping up the whole story. Not much surprises for me...

Yeah...Sam goes to Grey Havens in the end too i tink. Coz he's was a ring bearer, and the ring bearers get to go there..

they went there, basically coz they said at the end that it has come to the time of men, and they had no more role to play in Middle-Earth so they left for the West...

GaryDAI

12-26-2003, 06:36 AM

Hey GaryD, the part of Sam going to the Heaven is from the book??!? Then why does k.a.t say it's not?!?

I haven't read the book, so I wouldn't know :oops: I think Legolas and Gimli go there to later on.

Phyxius

12-26-2003, 06:55 AM

Then how do you know that Sam later on went?!? I dont recall it being told in the movie!?!

GaryDAI

12-26-2003, 07:30 AM

From the other places I visit :tongue: And it wasn't told in the movie :tongue: It wouldn't fit either because he's suppose to leave much later.

jjfgirl

12-26-2003, 09:14 AM

I thought this one was the best of the 3...i didn't even fall asleep for more than five mins. at first i thought the last half hour was completely unnecessary, but my friend argued otherwise...and i think it is important now. anyway, the only problem i had with it was that it's way too happy--i kept expecting one of teh main ppl to die and was a lil disappointed that it didn't happen. made it less...realistic for me, if that can be possible!

*SkyLark*

12-26-2003, 05:23 PM

Sam did venture into Valinor, or the Grey Havens in the end. He was made the mayor of the Shire. Sam's not adventure-thirsty like Bilbo, hence he's better off tending to his orchards and settling down in peace and quiet in Hobbiton. But since he did bear the ring for a while, he was entitiled entry too. :happy:

jjfgirl, Theoden died in the movie. You noticed that, didn't you? The King of Rohan... Eowyn was weeping buckets then. :cry:

As a friend of mine said, thus comes the end of the movie era. After ROTK, there's basically nothing more to look forward to. But if it fails to bag an honour at the next Oscars, the academy had better brace themselves for a mjor uprising. :laughing: [/quote]

GaryDAI

12-26-2003, 05:39 PM

Phyxius

12-27-2003, 06:23 AM

yes it is the end :cry: Now that I have seen all the LOTR movies there is nothing left to live for. No movie will ever come close to it :( But wait, the Extended edition will be released in a year :excited: After that though, my life will be a bore.

*nod in agreement* I've now only got the book to finish and once that's finished, there is no meaning to life! :cry: haha, many not quite that serious, but it will be a long time later when i'll go crazy for another movie like LOTR. Hey GaryD, have you seen the extention of TTT? I wonder if it's good.... The extention DVD is 2/3 more the price of the non-extended version here!!! So expensive!!! Did TFOLR have extended?

I was wondering... If at the end the eagles went and took Frodo and Sam back, then why didn't at first they just send the eagles to fly Frodo to Crack of Doom?!?! Will prevent all the fighing! Duh!~ *hits forehead with palm* Why didn't Tolkein think of that?!?! But then what's the fun in that?

ker_ai_teresa

12-27-2003, 06:43 AM

I was wondering... If at the end the eagles went and took Frodo and Sam back, then why didn't at first they just send the eagles to fly Frodo to Crack of Doom?!?! Will prevent all the fighing! Duh!~ *hits forehead with palm* Why didn't Tolkein think of that?!?! But then what's the fun in that?

phyxius, i assume you know of the Monkey Magic story? if you do then you'd also know that MM's "master", the Monk, had to walk step by step to the west to retrieve the holy scriptures/teachings. even when MM offered to fly them there on his cloud, his master refused.
try to think of Frodo's mission the same way. if he'd been flown there by the eagles, what story then is there to tell? LOTR like many good stories isn't just about what happens in the end, it's also about the process. and the process also involves the growth of the characters. a good example of this would be Sam. in the beginning he was just a gardener, living a simple Hobbit's life, never even daring to dream of leaving on an adventure. but by the end of the book we see that he has grown, in courage and wisdom of the world outside of the Shire.
also, the story isn't just about Frodo and the ring, although of course it is the main theme. the story is also fundamentally about Aragorn regaining his throne and regaining the respect and allegiance of Gondor. it is also about a divided Middle-earth banding together once more like they had in the past to defeat evil. how would we see any of this if Frodo had found an easy path to Mordor?

i think instead of considering the "what ifs" of the story, why don't we try to keep our discussion on what actually happened in the film.... :wink2:

anywayz, back to the film. i finally saw it last night! :excited: while sitting through 30 minutes of ads b4 the film came on, i was wondering how Peter Jackson would begin the story. i was pleasantly surprised that he chose to begin with the history of Smeagol, which i thought was a clever way to open the film. remind ppl how he'd gotten the ring and then from there go back to Frodo and Sam.
someone said previously that they were disappointed with Aragorn's character, that he didn't do anything significant. how can that be so??? his character showed such courage to go and gather the cursed army and convince them to fight for him. only he could have done that as the heir to the throne. without this army, no amount of heart and stength from individuals such as Legolas and even Gandulf could have saved Minas Tirith.
unlike others, i liked the ending. i felt that if Peter Jackson had somehow squeezed in the scouring of the Shire, it would have ruined the climax for me. the climax of the story was the war against Sauron and then the destroying of the ring. after that, peace comes upon Middle-earth, Aragorn is crowned king of Gondor and marries Arwen. the pace of the film slows down from here forth and the closure begins. if then the Hobbits were to return home to find that it was overrun with ruffians that they had get rid of them by fighting, this would create another climax, which wouldn't fit in well. i thought it made sense to just finish the story there instead of making another battle scene.

all in all, i really enjoyed it! can't wait for the trilogy dvd to come out! :excited:

Jess

12-27-2003, 07:17 AM

I'm so glad everyone loved the movie. My dad actually didn't like it much, which is odd, because he's always been a fan w/ me and the movies. But everyone to their own. On the other hand, I completely converted one of my cousins to Lord of the Rings and convinced him to read the books :D

That being said, EVERYONE THAT HASN'T READ THE BOOKS, GO READ THEM. Seriously, this is a must. It explains everything, and dare I say... the books are actually better than the movie. GASP. They can be "boring" and long, but really, this is what started the whole thing. At first I thought the books were boring, but I'm rereading all of them now, and they're all brilliant. The descriptions can be long, but there's so much that Peter Jackson left out that can't be missed!!! Go read them!!

Now to answer all the questions. I'll clear everything up, I guess...

hmm....about Saruman....my memory is failing me, but i thought the book didn't talk about him and wormtongue's death??? didn't Gandalf, Frodo and the others meet him in the forest, but Gandalf let him go? or did he die later? i can't remem...

What happens is, after the Scouring of the Shire, Frodo is willing to let Saruman and Wormtongue go. I don't want to ruin it, but to sum it up, Saruman says something to Wormtongue and kicks him (as if Wormtongue was a dog or a lowly servant), and as he's walking away Wormtongue runs up behind him and slits his throat. And then he maniacally laughs and runs off, but the hobbits shoot him with arrows and he dies. That's the rough version of it :tongue: and it WAS included in the books.

I was very upset with Denethor, the Steward. He did nothing for Gondor even though he knew that the Orcs are already advancing! And he's insane, didn't bother to check if Faramir is still alive and wanted to cremate him together with his own self. Of course, i hate the way he practice favouritism towards Boromir over Faramir.

stupid steward guy! gah. i have nothing against stupid ppl but only selfish ones must die! he deserved when gandolf whacked him in the face with his staff.

The part where i found misleading was why did Denethor (ex-King of Gondor) wanted to burn Faramir and wouldnt trust Pippin that he was alive?!? Weird guy, but it was funny when he jumped off the cliff thingy wrapped in fire! I cracked up.

NOOOO YOU GUYS!! Don't hate Denethor!! Peter Jackson made a huge mistake by cutting out the extra footage w/ Denethor. He is NOT a bad character. In the book, he's displayed as a wise, kind king. He's actually extremely nice to Pippin and courteous to Gandalf. But what happens is, after the death of his wife, through grief, he looks into his Palantir (big mistake). Sauron manipulates him and feeds him misinformation, showing him images of doom that might not necessarily come, and only giving him one side of what was happening. That is why Denethor is so upset throughout the movie and "complains" so much. And his death is very noble in the book -- they totally ruined his death. Shadowfax (Gandalf's horse) does not "shove" him into the fire, he does not run off the cliff burning. He lays down on the burning pyre and, holding the palantir, forfeits his life and dies. His death was supposed to be sad, and unfortuanetely, through the way that Peter Jackson filmed it, it had people clapping and cheering when he ran off the cliff.

I think it's because of editing. I think a little later on in that scene, one of the orcs toss a mithril shirt to the ground. Sort of a claim that Frodo is dead? That's why aragon said "for frodo" or something like that. I have to watch the movie again.

Yeah I think it was because of the editing too. They cut out the MoS (Mouth of Sauron), a very key part of the book. Sauron sends out his "speaker" (since he cannot take physical form) who ba

sically laughs at them and shows them Frodo's mithril shirt and other belongings. He and Aragorn confront each other, and the MoS offers them a choice. He does make it seem that Frodo is dead, however, which may explain the "For Frodo" thing.

hmmm..... there's another part which i dun get? Why does Frodo leave at the end? Where is he going???

Frodo leaves to the Grey Havens, which is basically leaving Middle-Earth. Don't you remember when he's slowly walking down the steps of his home in Bag End, taking a sip of his drink? He says, "How do you pick up the threads of an old life? How do you go on, when in your heart you begin to understand: there is no going back. There are some things that time cannot mend. Some hurts that go too deep... that have taken hold." He's been through too much, he's seen too much. He has wounds that will pain him forever, and there's no way to heal them... except going to the Grey Havens. There he can finally find peace and he can rest. Bilbo also goes because he was also a ringbearer, so he carried some of the same pains that Frodo did. There was one last ship leaving Middle-Earth, the one that Elrond, Celeborn, Galadriel, and Gandalf also were taking their leave on, and they allowed both of them to leave with them. Which was actually a big thing, because no one but elves really went there.

i'm not sure whether Sam eventually goes to the Grey Havens as well because the book doesn't mention this.

Sam does go. And it does say it in the books, but in the appendix. After Rosie dies (:cry:) Sam resigns as mayor (he had retaken the job 7 times!) and it is said that he leaves the Shire. No one sees him again, but it's rumoured that he finally left to go to the Grey Havens to become reunited with Frodo again, and after all.. he WAS one of the three ringbearers, though only for a short time.

I haven't read the book, so I wouldn't know I think Legolas and Gimli go there to later on.

They do. Once Aragorn dies, Legolas decides it's finally his time to leave Middle-Earth. He leaves for the Grey Havens, and takes Gimli too, because Gimli was his truest and most loyal friend. It's a strange situation for Gimli to go to the Grey Havens because he was a dwarf, and many people know of the rivalry between dwarves and elves, but they allow it, and Legolas is forever grateful. So in a way, the Fellowship is reunited somewhat at the Grey Havens.. except Aragorn, Pippin, and Merry remain in Middle-Earth (and Boromir, as you know, couldn't make it).

Anymore questions?? Seriously, I love answering these. Any uncertain questions you have, go ahead and ask them :yeah:

ker_ai_teresa

12-27-2003, 07:32 AM

Jess

12-27-2003, 07:41 AM

Jess--> you even read the appendix??? :ohmy:
.
.
.
:bow:

do you by any chance have Unfinished Tales as well? :? it's a compilation of some details that Tolkien didn't include into LOTR and The Hobbits...

I actually didn't read the Unfinished Tales or... *gasp* the Silmarillion!!! ¬¬ I admit now!! I didn't read the Silmarillion!! That basically tells the entire backstory of all the elves, but.. I didn't read it!!!

Hey if you guys are too lazy to read the books (-INSERT EVIL DEATH GLARE HERE-) then you should buy the book Weapons & Warfare of LOTR. At first I thought it was just on.. you know, weapons and warfare but it has the entire history of LOTR and speaks about all the individual characters and it's REALLY useful. It has a lot of information you wouldn't get from just seeing the movies and it's a good guide if you don't feel like reading through the 1000 pages, EVEN THOUGH YOU SHOULD IF YOU WANT TO LIVE.

Anyway.

unlike others, i liked the ending. i felt that if Peter Jackson had somehow squeezed in the scouring of the Shire, it would have ruined the climax for me. the climax of the story was the war against Sauron and then the destroying of the ring. after that, peace comes upon Middle-earth, Aragorn is crowned king of Gondor and marries Arwen. the pace of the film slows down from here forth and the closure begins. if then the Hobbits were to return home to find that it was overrun with ruffians that they had get rid of them by fighting, this would create another climax, which wouldn't fit in well. i thought it made sense to just finish the story there instead of making another battle scene.

I completely agree. At first, I thought... no scouring of the shire?? That makes me sad... :cry: because it was such a good part of the book. And a part of me still is sad that he left it out, because this is what shows the people of Hobbiton how much courage these four hobbits have (since they didn't really know much about the War of the Ring), and this is what makes them the hero of the Shire. And when Frodo says, "We set out to save the Shire, Sam. And it has been saved. But not for me." there actually is much more to the comment. People will think, "Ah, he means saving the shire as in destroying the Ring", but in the book, it's actually a reference to the Scouring ^^

But the ending was perfect. The emotion was all there, the happiness you feel is all there, it was just.. perfect. The Scouring would have started the movie up again and sometimes you don't really want that. Peter Jackson and Philippa were right when they said that it would just be too much. The ending was good enough as it was. I wouldn't have it any other way :wink2:

ankh

12-27-2003, 07:52 AM

WOAH Jess.
:bow: :bow: :bow:

I've got a question... though it's from the Two Towers.
The part about Faramir bringing Frodo and Sam to Minas Tirith(or was it somewhere else?), that didn't happen in the book right?
And what's the significance of the part when Frodo was face to face with the Nazgul on the winged creature... and why did Faramir then decide to release them?

And I felt that the movie did Frodo injustice.
He seemed so much like a weakling, esp in the Fellowship.
My friend even hates him, to the point she won't even buy a magazine with him on the cover.
Maybe it was the editing... like in the Fellowship when Frodo was stabbed by a morgul blade. The movie seems to show him unable to hang on only for a few hours, though in actual fact it was almost a month until the blade affected him.
And the part where Arwen rescues him. It wasn't her! It was Glorfindel. And it was Frodo himself that called the riders to leave, not Arwen.
Anyone feels the same way?

GaryDAI

12-27-2003, 08:01 AM

I'm not sure what went on with the scouring and all since I didn't read the book. But I think it would of ruined the happy ending don't you think?

I'm going to go see it again on monday. But I have to go by myself because no one wants to see it again :tongue: They liked the movie but there bladder was going to explode :laughing:

edit: I agree with you ankh :) I think the main reason for such a large role for Arwen was to attract more viewers. They didn't really know how it would do box office wise :tongue: So they put a good looking girl to attract the guys. Obviously that wasn't necessary and I think many purist (book readers) don't like Arwen enlarged role. Personally, I thought she was ok. Nothing special though.

I am looking forward to seeing Eoywn again though. I guess I have a fetish with girls kicking butt :oops: I have said too much.......

Significance of Frodo being face to face with that Nazgul? nothing really in my mind. It just gave Sam the opportunity to make that wonderful speech :) I don't even think that part was in the book.

Peter Jackson did make alot of changes but that is to be expected. Direct transfer of a book to the big screen does not work well. I hope he didn't upset the purist too much though :/

Jess

12-27-2003, 08:15 AM

The part about Faramir bringing Frodo and Sam to Minas Tirith(or was it somewhere else?), that didn't happen in the book right?
And what's the significance of the part when Frodo was face to face with the Nazgul on the winged creature... and why did Faramir then decide to release them?

Actually, Faramir brought Frodo and Sam to Osgoliath, which was a part of Minas Tirith, but more of a defense system. In ROTK, you can see Osgoliath from Minas Tirith. Unfortuatenly, it was lost to the orcs when Faramir's men couldn't hold it, but in TTT, it was under Gondor's control.

In the book, Faramir actually met and talked with Frodo and Sam at the place of their meeting, and then "didn't let them go" and took them to the Window of the West, or Henneth Annun (which was included in the movie, w/ Gollum and the Forbidden Pool). However, he lets them go after that, and doesn't take them with him to Osgoliath.

I guess the significance of the confrontation between the Nazgul and Frodo was to show Faramir how much the Ring had a hold over him, and how it controls you. It kinda showed him a light that the Ring could not be handled by Men, or anyone else, except the one that made it, Sauron. And he overhears Sam's "encouraging speech" given to Frodo, which really showed him how much these two hobbits were going through just for the destruction of the Ring. So he understood and decided that there was no real point in him hindering them when they had come so far, and when their task was hard enough.

It kinda disappoints me that Peter Jackson had to do this to Faramir though. In the book, Faramir listened to their story and when he found out that Frodo was indeed the Ringbearer, goes through a minor inner conflict. I mean, you saw how Denethor thought of Faramir in ROTK, so he wanted to finally do something to show his father that he was of greater worth. But he decides that the Ring really could not be wielded and he just lets them go there. He doesn't try to take the Ring like Boromir does. That's why Faramir is known to be stronger and wiser than his older brother, because he could resist the urge of the Ring. Peter Jackson destroys that about him by forcing Frodo and Sam to go with him, but I guess it worked out in the end.

And I felt that the movie did Frodo injustice.
He seemed so much like a weakling, esp in the Fellowship.
My friend even hates him, to the point she won't even buy a magazine with him on the cover.

Here I kinda hafta disagree with you. Frodo is, to me, shown as a strong character in that he does what he does as the Ringbearer. In a way he is a weak character, because the effect the Ring has on him, but then again, anyone else would go through the same problems w/ the Ring had they been carrying it. The movie portrays Frodo as he is in the book, filled with conflicts and also fighting the corruption that the Ring brought to people. Of course compared to the rest of the Fellowship he looks weak. Gandalf, the wizard. Aragorn, the future king of Gondor, and Boromir, a very strong warrior. Legolas, an elven archer, and Gimli, one of the strongest of the dwarves. And then Merry and Pippin, who offer their loyalt and fealty to their respective kings (Merry to Theoden, Pippin to Denethor), and Sam, who of course, plays a very integral part of the Fellowship (I LOVE YOU SAM!!! I LOVE YOU!!!!!!!!! :love:). And then there's Frodo, who is merely bearing the Ring. This doesn't seem like such a big deal, but on top of being such a small person, he's the one really "saving" Middle-Earth. Of course he couldn't get through it without everyone else but it's hard enough to be doing what he's doing.

Maybe it was the editing... like in the Fellowship when Frodo was stabbed by a morgul blade. The movie seems to show him unable to hang on only for a few hours, though in actual fact it was almost a month until the blade affected h

im.

It was? Wait, can you explain that a little more? I think I should reread that part of the book... but the blade did have an immediate effect, didn't it? Afterall, it was the poisonous blade of the Witch-King... the way the blade disintegrated when Aragorn held it up... a fragment of the blade had gone into Frodo and would have otherwise traveled to his heart, sending him into the shadowed, wraith world, had Elrond not helped him heal, though he didn't heal fully.

And the part where Arwen rescues him. It wasn't her! It was Glorfindel. And it was Frodo himself that called the riders to leave, not Arwen.
Anyone feels the same way?

A lot of book fans went crazy when they found out that Arwen was the one who rescued Frodo. I guess Peter Jackson didn't want to include Glorfindel, and wanted to make Arwen's role in LOTR more significant. I don't agree with this, but some things have to be changed for the movie, and I guess we have to live with it.

edit:

Significance of Frodo being face to face with that Nazgul? nothing really in my mind. It just gave Sam the opportunity to make that wonderful speech I don't even think that part was in the book.

It was!! It was part of the book!! It was one of my favorite parts. I'll type it up in my next post :)

GaryDAI

12-27-2003, 08:27 AM

Angels on clouds

12-27-2003, 08:30 AM

haha Jess, mabbe u shld juz type out the whole story..though that would take forever. heh. :laughing:

the editing took quite a lot out of the final film...the love story between Faramir n Eowyn, Aragorn healing Eowyn, Gandalf confronting a Nazgul and a few others. i saw shots of these scenes in documentaries and Behind-the-scenes shows. But otherwise, can u imagine a 4 hr film?
there was so many pple going to the toilet during the show, esp when Gandalf started talking to Aragorn etc, at least 10 pple got up from their seats. heh.

GaryDAI

12-27-2003, 08:33 AM

I think the gandalf vs witchking scene will be in the Extended Edition.

http://members.aol.com/ryuujinhz02/lotr.jpg

That scene was in the TTT dvd in the ROTK preview section :tongue: They have updated it though. I saw another pic and the witchking was in his armor and all. Obviously the pic above he doesn't have anything on :tongue:

edit: I found the newer pic! http://members.aol.com/ryuujinhz02/lotr_gandalfwiki.jpg

The extended edition is rumored to be 4hours 50minutes long :excited: I can't wait! I am going to be the first one at the video store to get my copy :laughing:

I believe a scene between eowyn and faramir will take place as well. I believe in the house of healing?

ankh

12-27-2003, 08:48 AM

REALLY?
Can't wait to get the Extended Version then.
When will it be out?

Jess:
Eh probably I wasn't clear in my desciption and I may have mixed up a few facts here and there, since I read the books last year in a hurry.

I wasn't saying that Frodo is a weak character.
But that was the impression being laid down on me after I watched the Fellowship, without reading the book.
AFTER reading the book, my impression of Frodo changed for the better.
He's a very STRONG character, and what I'm saying is that the potrayal of him is somewhat weaker than what he should be from the book.
Most viewers don't understand the immense burden of the Ring.

Yes the blade did have an immediate effect on Frodo.
I think I read something like it would penetrate to his heart... and once it does that, Frodo will become one of them.
Actually I'm not too sure... :oops:

Several other characters were sorta underplayed too.
Faramir, like what Jess mentioned.
Eowyn too. Somehow I feel most of her presence were taken away by the overly enlarged role of Arwen.

I was kinda sad they didn't show much about the relationship between the dwarves and elves.
Very evident in the blindfolding part when the Fellowship entered Lothlorien.

Angels on clouds

12-27-2003, 08:54 AM

The extended edition is rumored to be 4hours 50minutes long I can't wait! I am going to be the first one at the video store to get my copy

GaryDAI, that would probably be another year later. Then they might take another year, to put all 3 films together as a 9hr+ show. So we'll still have LOTR to look out for! heh :laughing:

Jess

12-27-2003, 09:01 AM

ah it was? I heard that it wasn't. I think maybe it was another part of that scene. The part where he sort of holds the ring up so that it's visible. Wouldn't the Nazgul see that he has it? He was right in front of him.

Sam is your favorite character Jess? I think he deserves to win an oscar for his performance :) Maybe he will, you never know.

Oh DEFINITELY. Sean Astin (who played Sam) completely deserves an Oscar for his performance as Sam. Every scene with him and Frodo was just so powerful. He's also a minor director, and though he's acted in several movies before, he's never won an Oscar. He was nominated before for an Academy Award before for a small film he directed (Kangaroo Court) but he didn't win. I think this should be his year!! (or 2004, rather) Sam.. *sigh* :love: The true hero of the story.

You can read the exerpt at the bottom of this post :excited:

haha Jess, mabbe u shld juz type out the whole story..though that would take forever. heh. :laughing:

... :cry:

the editing took quite a lot out of the final film...the love story between Faramir n Eowyn, Aragorn healing Eowyn, Gandalf confronting a Nazgul and a few others. i saw shots of these scenes in documentaries and Behind-the-scenes shows. But otherwise, can u imagine a 4 hr film?
there was so many pple going to the toilet during the show, esp when Gandalf started talking to Aragorn etc, at least 10 pple got up from their seats. heh.

I could imagine a 4 hr film :excited: but I know other people wouldn't welcome such a long movie.

"I wouldn't trust it," said Sam, "not till I was dying of thirst. There's a wicked feeling about this place." He sniffed. "And a smell, I fancy. Do you notice it? A queer kind of a smell, stuffy. I don't like it."

"I don't like anything here at all," said Frodo, "step or stone, breath or bone. Earth, air and water all seem accursed. But so our path is laid."

"Yes, that's so," said Sam. "And we shouldn't be here at all, if we'd known more about it before we started. But I suppose it's often that way. The brave things in the old tales and songs, Mr. Frodo: adventures, as I used to call them. I used to think that they were things the wonderful folk of the stories went out and looked for, because they wanted them, because they were exciting and life was a bit dull, a kind of a sport, as you might say. But that's not the way of it with the tales that really mattered, or the ones that stay in the mind. Folk seem to have been just landed in them, usually -- their paths were laid that way, as you put it. But I expect they had lots of chances, like us, of turning back, only they didn't. And if they had, we shouldn't know, because they'd have been forgotten. We hear about those as just went on -- and not all to a good end, mind you; at least not to what folk inside a story and not outside it call a good end. You know, coming home, and finding things all right, though not quite the same -- like old Mr. Bilbo. But those aren't always the best tales to hear, though they may be the best tales to get landed in! I wonder what sort of a tale we've fallen into?"

"I wonder," said Frodo. "But I don't know. And that's the way of a real tale. Take any one that you're fond of. You may know, or guess, what kind of a tale it is, happy-ending or sad-ending, but the people in it don't know. And you don't want them to."

"No, sir, of course not. Beren now, he never thought he was going to get the Silmaril from the Iron Crown in Thangorodrim, and yet he did, and that was a worse place and a blacker danger than ours. But that's a long tale, of course, and goes on past the happiness and into giref and beyond it -- and the Silmaril went on and came to Earendil. And why, sir, I never thought of that before! We've got -- you've got some of the light of it in that star

-glass that the Lady gave you! Why, to think of it, we're in the same tale still! It's going on. Don't the great tales never end?"

"No, they never end as tales," said Frodo. "But the people in them come, and go when their part's ended. Our part will end later -- or sooner."

"And then we can have some rest and some sleep," said Sam. He laughed grimly. "And I mean just that, Mr. Frodo. I mean just plain ordinary rest, and sleep, and waking up to a morning's work in the garden. I'm afraid that's all I'm hoping for all the time. All the big important plans are not for my sort. Still, I wonder if we shall ever be put into songs or tales. We're in one, of course; but I mean: put into words, you know, told by the fireside, or read out of a great big book with red and black letters, years and years afterwards. And people will say: 'Let's hear about Frodo and the Ring!' and they'll say: 'Yes, that's one of my favourite stories. Frodo was very brave, wasn't he, dad?' 'Yes, my boy, the most famousest of hobbits, and that's saying a lot."

"It's saying a lot too much," said Frodo, and he laughed, a long clear laugh from his heart. Such a sound had not been heard in those places since Sauron came to Middle-Earth. To Sam suddenly it seemed as if all the stones were listening and the tall rocks leaning over them. But Frodo did not heed them; he laughed again. "Why, Sam," he said, "to hear you somehow makes me as merry as if the story was already written. But you've left out one of the chief characters: Samwise the stouthearted. 'I want to hear more about Sam, dad. Why didn't they put in more of his talk, dad? That's what I like, that's what makes me laugh. And Frodo wouldn't have got far without Sam, would he, dad?'"

"Now, Mr. Frodo," said Sam, "you shouldn't make fun. I was serious."

"So was I," said Frodo, "and so I am."

edit:

I think the gandalf vs witchking scene will be in the Extended Edition.

Oh yes, that will probably definitely be included in the EE. They can't leave it out! Also, in the confrontation between them, the Witch-King breaks Gandalf's staff. A lot of people think that's the reason as to why Gandalf's eyes look so tired when he says "So passes Denethor, Steward of Gondor..." and I don't think he had his staff at the time. That's why he had to grab the spear of the guard to push Denethor off the burning pyre.

I believe a scene between eowyn and faramir will take place as well. I believe in the house of healing?

Yes, I think that's also going to be included. The "googly eyes" at Aragorn's coronation wasn't enough; and they needed to have a reason as to why Eowyn and Merry were all of a sudden all healed. Peter Jackson better put that in the EE, to show the relationship between Eowyn and Faramir too!!!

I was kinda sad they didn't show much about the relationship between the dwarves and elves.
Very evident in the blindfolding part when the Fellowship entered Lothlorien.

Me too... that was what made Legolas & Gimli's relationship so special, but they didn't stress the importance enough. In the movie, the relationship was more of a comic relief joke thing, but I believe it meant a lot more. They also didn't include the part where Legolas promised he would go see the Glittering Caves with Gimli if the Ring was ever destroyed and they made it through alive, but only if Gimli promised to visit the elven woods with him. That was a very sweet, meaningful part to me.

ankh

12-27-2003, 09:21 AM

They also didn't include the part where Legolas promised he would go see the Glittering Caves with Gimli if the Ring was ever destroyed and they made it through alive, but only if Gimli promised to visit the elven woods with him. That was a very sweet, meaningful part to me.

YES! This part too...
The most obvious scene would be before the Fight at the Black Gate.

Gimli: I never thought I'd die side by side with an Elf.
Legolas: What about side by side with a friend?
Gimli: Aye. I could do that

Jess

12-27-2003, 09:47 AM

YES! This part too...
The most obvious scene would be before the Fight at the Black Gate.

Gimli: I never thought I'd die side by side with an Elf.
Legolas: What about side by side with a friend?
Gimli: Aye. I could do that

Oh, I loved that scene. I think it shows the friendship between them perfectly. That was one of the best moments of the film... Their friendship is a lot more than just competing in who got the greatest amount of orc kills, though that was a factor :D

ker_ai_teresa

12-27-2003, 11:28 AM

did this happen when you guys were watching ROTK: in the scene where Frodo wakes up from his sleep after the eagles have brought him and Sam back from the Cracks of Doom, and he says "Gandulf?", everybody in the cinema just cracked up laughing! :laughing: we laughed even harder when Pippin and merry started jumping on the bed and then Gimli walks in...hehe....that was a weird scene.

regina12

12-27-2003, 01:56 PM

Oh haha! :laughing: It was weird how Frodo said Gandalf's name... like in slow mo. The pple I was watching with didn't laugh at that, though we all did clap after Legolas' fighting scene on the oliophaunt and right at the end of the movie. Like all agreeing that it was such a fantastic movie! :)

pop

12-27-2003, 02:50 PM

this is to clear the 'what if' that phyxius created

phyxius wrote:
I was wondering... If at the end the eagles went and took Frodo and Sam back, then why didn't at first they just send the eagles to fly Frodo to Crack of Doom?!?! Will prevent all the fighing! Duh!~ *hits forehead with palm* Why didn't Tolkein think of that?!?! But then what's the fun in that?

that's because if frodo were to fly with the eagles without all the fighting then sauron won't be distracted and the eagles will be easily destroyed by sauron!!!
besides how would the eagles know where frodo and sam is...the land of Mordor is vast!![/quote]

ankh

12-27-2003, 03:31 PM

Teresa, those people I was watching with didn't laugh at that scene.
There was one, however, that kept laughing almost throughout the whole trilogy. (I have no idea why)

Yeah regina, there was a rousing applause after Legolas' fanciful solo fight with the oliphaunt.
Legolas always get all the fanciful fighting scenes.
Like the one he skate-boards and shoots down the stairs of Helm's Deep.
And the one he one-handedly swing himself up a horse.
Impressive, but exaggerating. It cracked me up. :D

Phyxius

12-28-2003, 08:22 AM

um... Can someone jst type out the whole book!?? LOL...jst kidding.... It seems like that some of you here already have!! :laughing:

Anyway, like i posted at the other LOTR thread i started, I saw a special thing on the TV about ROTK.
The reporters was interviewing Billy Boyd aka Pippin and asked him wat happened to Pippin afterwards and he said that Pippin married a girl and had a baby named after Faramir. Then when he is about to die (of old age), he and Merry went to Gondor and was buried alongside King Aragorn!!! How sweet is that!?!?
The friendship and loyalty theme is really strong in this film!! Bravo! JRR Tolkein!

adnam8

12-28-2003, 10:29 AM

ankh

12-28-2003, 11:33 AM

The reporters was interviewing Billy Boyd aka Pippin and asked him wat happened to Pippin afterwards and he said that Pippin married a girl and had a baby named after Faramir.

Yeah, Pippin married and had a son called Faramir I.
It was done in loving dedication to Faramir, ever since Pippin saved him from the fire.The movie does not show how much Pippin admires Faramir.
It is most evident from this quote in the book, when Pippin first sees Faramir:

'When he saw the pale face of Faramir he caught his breath. It was the face of one who had been assailed by a great fear or anguish, but has mastered it and now is quiet. Proud and grave he stood for a moment... and Pippin gazing at him saw how closely he resembled his brother Boromir - whom Pippin had liked from the first, admiring the great man's lordly but kindly manner. Yet suddenly for Faramir his heart was strangely moved with a feeling that he had not known before. Here was one with an air of high nobility such as Aragorn at times revealed, less high perhaps, yet also less incalculable and remote: one of the Kings of Men born into a later time, but touched with the wisdom and sadness of the Eldar Race. He knew now why Beregond spoke his name with love. He was a captain that men would follow, that he would follow, even under the shadow of the black wings.'

Another interesting fact:
Sam and Rosie had 13 children!
--Elanor, Frodo, Pippin, Bilbo, Goldilocks, Hamfast, Merry, Tolman, Robin, Rose, Daisy, Primrose, and Ruby
Notice that he also named his children after the names of his beloved friends.

GaryDAI

12-28-2003, 06:12 PM

13 children!?!?!?! Gosh, Sam and his wife were quite the active couple, weren't they? :laughing:

Phyxius: They didn't ride the eagles cause they would of died before they got there. You can't just fly into there :tongue: The eagles will be easily spotted and killed. It'll be a suicide mission.

zhy378

12-28-2003, 06:53 PM

yay, i finally watched the movie. still wished it didn't ended so there will be more.hehe. i guess back to the book for me, still needa finish return of the king.
hmm... i kinda liked the part with the spider, She. even though it was kinda scary but still, hecka big spider. good thing my sis didn't come to watch with me and my cousins or she'll be having nightmares or atleast fear more of spiders.hehe

SW33T_S3NSAT10N_D3S1R3

12-29-2003, 01:34 AM

I saw it on my friend's b-day which was like dec.19!! Oh man was it ever awesome!!! :) The end though just never seemed to finish, it kept on going on n on... Oh yeah, legolos, extremely dreamy, can't stressed that out enough. :happy: His smile was so cute!! Anyways, i feel like watching it again!! Maybe i'll go sometime!! :brows:

Phyxius

12-29-2003, 02:09 AM

Jess, does it take you one hour or sumthing to type out one reply?!? You amaze me... with your well-know knowledge on the book and the movie. :shock:

Now it seems that everyone at the end has gone to Grey Havens! LOL, Bilbo, Frodo, Gandalf, Elrond, Galadriel even Legolas and Gimli! Seems like Grey Haven is somewhere you can jst magically go! Didn't Jess or sumone say that in the movie when Frodo leaves for Grey Haven that's the last boat leaving Middle Earth? Then how does Legolas and Gimli manage to get there later? They flew???

Now i'm forcing my dad to let me go watch it again. Since this is the last instalment, there will be no more LOTR to look forward to, so I should grab this chance.

I'm busy reading the book at the moment. But i don't read too fast, incase i finish too fast and have nothing to look forward to. I'm not a fast reader anyway, so it might take me half a year to finish the book, coz the writing is too small and i read at bedtime, it hurts my eyes and i get sleepy... LOL! Seems like never going to finish it. I'm only up to 'shortcuts to the mushroom' on the first book! Wat a shame :blush:

Angels on clouds

12-29-2003, 09:38 AM

i got this in a mail. Its pretty funny, esp No 7. I'll post another LOTR Ah Beng spoof in my next post. :laughing:

THINGS TO DO WHILE WATCHING "THE RETURN OF THE KING"

1.Stand up halfway through the movie and yell loudly, "Wait... where the hell is Harry Potter?!?"

2.Block the entrance to the theatre while screaming, "YOU SHALL NOT
PASS!"

3.After the movie, say "Lucas could have done it better." [Sure fire suicide method.]

4.At some point during the movie, stand up and shout, "I must go!
Middle-earth needs me!", run and try to jump into the screen. After
bouncing off, return quietly to your seat.

5.Play a drinking game where you have to take a sip every time someone
says, "the Ring".

6.Ask the nearest Ring-nut if he thinks Gandalf went to Hogworts.

7.Finish off every one of Elrond's lines with "Mr Anderson". :wink2:

8.When Aragorn is crowned king, stand up and at the top of your lungs
sing, "And I did it MY WAY!"

9.Talk like Gollum all through the movie. At the end, bite off someone's
finger and fall down the stairs.

10.When Shelob appears, pinch the guy in front of you on the back of the
neck.

11.Dress up as old ladies and re-enact the Battle of Helm's Deep, Monty
Python-style.

12.When Denethor lights the fire, shout "Barbecue!" :dry:

13.Ask people around you who they think is the next Terminator sent from the Middle-earth future to assassinate Frodo Baggins.

14.In "The Two Towers", when the Ents march to war, stand up and shout, "Run, Forest! Run!"

15. Every time someone kills an Orc, yell, "That's what I'm Tolkien about!"

16.See how long it takes before you get kicked out of the theatre.

18.During a wide-angle shot of a battle, ask "Where's Waldo?"

19.Talk loudly about how you heard that there is a single frame of a nude
Elf hidden somewhere in the movie.

20.Start an Orc sing-along.

21.Come to the premiere dressed as Frank N Furter and wander around
looking terribly confused.

22.Remove the top off your drink, then set fire to the straw. Tell people
in the seats around you about a great battle that took place in your
cup long ago.

23.When they go into the Paths of the Dead, wait for a tense moment, and shout, "I see dead people!"

24.Imitate what you think a conversation between Gollum, Dobby, and Yoda would be like.

25.Release a jar of daddy-longlegs into the theatre during the Shelob
scene.

26.When Shelob comes on, exclaim, "Man! Charlotte's really let herself
go!"

destined

12-29-2003, 07:45 PM

hahaha that is so dumb!!

anywayz i finally watched rotk Today, the cinema was packed, i nearly cried in some bits when frodo tells sam to leave because he thinks sam wants the ring.
and i thought it was digusting when gollum bites of frodo's finger.

Phyxius

12-30-2003, 02:25 AM

Wahahahaha!!! Angels on Cloud, thanx for sharing sooo much!!! I'm cracking up badly at the mo LMAO!!! :lolabove:

These are the ones i like:
2.Block the entrance to the theatre while screaming, "YOU SHALL NOT
PASS!"

4.At some point during the movie, stand up and shout, "I must go!
Middle-earth needs me!", run and try to jump into the screen. After
bouncing off, return quietly to your seat.

12.When Denethor lights the fire, shout "Barbecue!" :dry:

24.Imitate what you think a conversation between Gollum, Dobby, and Yoda would be like.

and my fav one is...

7.Finish off every one of Elrond's lines with "Mr Anderson".

gr8t_gal

12-30-2003, 02:27 AM

LOL!!!!!!! :D
Angel on Cloud- THAT IS SOO HILARIOUS!!!! ^v^ I'm sending that to my friends!!!!! Oh thank u! ^v^ It's sooo hilarious! LOL!

Phyxius, in the story- Legolas and Gimli did go. I think they both went on another boat (separately) to the sea of something (forgot the name). But pity they didn't have wings to fly... :)
So Legolas and Gimli also went to the sea on a boat (in the book- they both made promise to each other- that Gimli would show Legolas the mine of something or cave, and Legolas would show Gimli the sea or something, forgot the name).

I watched LOTR on 19th Dec as well. :) It was great and of course- packed. *cough cough* -_- I do feel abit sorry for those who were sitting around me, becoz' my best friend was poking me and i'd end up laughing or giggling (even when there are um... scenes that are not suppose to laugh). Oops! *sweatdrop* ^_^*

linny

12-30-2003, 05:13 AM

Phyxius, in the story- Legolas and Gimli did go. I think they both went on another boat (separately) to the sea of something (forgot the name). But pity they didn't have wings to fly... :)
So Legolas and Gimli also went to the sea on a boat (in the book- they both made promise to each other- that Gimli would show Legolas the mine of something or cave, and Legolas would show Gimli the sea or something, forgot the name).

I went home and checked my ROTK book about that since it kind of disturbed me that I didn't know this. So, I couldn't find it at the end of the book. I had to check in the Appendices. So! Here's the answer:

After Aragorn dies, which is some 100+ years after he becomes king, Legolas builds a ship and sails to the Grey Havens with Gimli.

So, I'm going to assume that the Grey Havens is supposed to be open to the older races who want to leave Middle-Earth since when Aragorn became king, he began the Fourth Age, which was then dubbed the Age of Men. I ~think~ the Grey Havens was reserved for the Elves and those that were deserving of the privilege, such as Frodo and Gandalf. Sam himself sailed there after Rose died since he was also a Ring Bearer. *cough*

[insert fangirl moment here]OHMYHOLYNESS FARAMIR IS SO COOL! He's such an awesome character and I love how crazily cool he is and didn't you notice how MEAN Denethor was to him? and how could any decent parent do that to his only surviving child? and I like Aragorn and Legolas too and aaaaah.[/fangirl]

Glad to have that out of my system~!

lil~jo

12-30-2003, 05:29 AM

Angel on Clouds....: thats really creative....I'd love to actually do that....but ....the managers would probably just kick me out....hehe....
Phyxius: I could fly up to Auckland and plan to do something like that with you*^^* hehe

Angels on clouds

12-30-2003, 06:37 AM

Here's the ah beng one, but prob only the Singaporeans would fully understand it. :glug:

Tolkien For Bengs
So the new Lord of the Rings movie is coming out, and you want to impress
some Ah Lian you're trying to buaya by being able to explain the whole
complicated plot with all the funny sounding names and words. You want to
seem like you've actually read all 3 books, but damn suay even The New
Paper is too 'cheem' for you. Neh'mine! Dun scared! Here is our easy to
understand guide to J.R.R. Tolkein's trilogy, written specially in the
conversational style of Ah Bengs, so you can memorize:

THE FELLOWSHIP OF THE RING

Last time got this short-short person with si-beh hairy legs called Bilbo, lor.
He, hor, got this ring that last time belong to some monster.

But then, hor, one day suay-suay the monster want it back, and send his
kah kiah to Bilbo's house to settle, lah.

But the ring, hor, acherly can make people very powderful. But then, hor,
if you wear too long will also kena sai. Si beh hiong one, so better faster go
and destroy it, lor.

So Bilbo's nephew Frodo. Aiyah, dun ask me why their name all so funny, can
or not? You ask me, I ask who?

Anyway, Frodo and some peng yew kena arrow to go and destroy the ring.

But donno why also, they must do it in the monster's home, which is at the
end of New Zealand there.

So they walk and walk and walk across New Zealand, lah. And then along the
way, got monster chase them, got people want to hoot them, some of them
dieded, all sorts of thing, lah.

At the end, Frodo and Sam, his pooi-pooi friend who I think so is a bit ah
quah, got separated from the rest.

THE TWO TOWERS

Frodo and Sam meet up with this thing called Gollum, who look like he take
too much Slim 10 like that.

At the same time, hor, the other friends get into some powderful hooting
session, where, wah lau eh, even the trees can do gongfu one. They all
fight over what, I also donno, but quite kan cheong, lah.

THE RETURN OF THE KING

In the end, Frodo and his peng yew all win leow, lah. Arbuthen?

This condensed version of J.R.R. Tolkein's Lord of the Rings trilogy was
brought to you courtesy of the Coxford Singlish Dictionary.

Phyxius

12-30-2003, 10:42 AM

Phyxius: I could fly up to Auckland and plan to do something like that with you*^^* hehe

You really coming?!? haha... doubt it....
I'm going to go watch it again tomolo... Yippy! I'll try do some of those things.... LOL

Angel on clouds, i dun quite get ur chinese and english mixed together paragraph... that's weird! haha

lil~jo

12-30-2003, 10:57 AM

Oh,
Angels on clouds: You from Singapore?
hehe, I'm guessing now many people here really understood what you wrote there*^^*
But I did, (I'm from Malaysia)
Phyxius: I'll come up sometime, don't know whether I'll be stopping in Auckland when I fly to Malaysia, but if I do, I'll make sure I stop by!
Oh and by the way! Hehe.....make sure you do the Mr Anderson one!

Phyxius

12-31-2003, 02:24 AM

NP :) As long as you do it with me... Keke
So you going bak to Malaysia via AKL?
:offtopic:

lil~jo

12-31-2003, 02:49 AM

Yeah, I noticed we're talking off the topic!
But yeah, I'm not sure if I'll be stopping over, I'll make sure I PM you if I do ok?

I'd love to watch RotK again....
I love to see the hobbits....their so short and cute.
hehe....
I think they didn't show enough of Legolas though...

Jess

12-31-2003, 03:01 AM

I actually got to see ROTK for my 5th time over the weekend, it gets better and better everytime (except the people in the theater were really annoying). I must see it again, I say...

Anyway,

I found a thread in another forum giving very good points on how all three movies work together to make a final, powerful trilogy. Many of the things that happened in the beginning, in FOTR, are again seen in ROTK. Gathering and compiling all of these, here they are:

FOTR brings the Fellowship together and follows it in a fairly linear way until the break-up.

TTT has THREE separate strands within it (it is the most complex structurally of the three, and it is the least understood at this stage).

ROTK begins to collect the strands together again, and echoes the previous films in many ways - particularly using reflection and mirroring.

a) the Gollum backstory has Shire type colouring (vivid greens) for almost the first time since the early part of FOTR

b)the ROTK "prologue" is focused on the Ring and its effects, almost as much as the main prologue to FOTR - and we get the grubby hand shot;

c) Gandalf rides to Isengard as he did early in FOTR

d) the Meduseld party echoes Bilbo's leaving party complete with speech

e) Gandalf enjoys himself at the party (claps0 he danced at Bilbo's - first time we have seen him like this since;

f) Pippin and Merry dance and sing on a table as in the Green Dragon (as in FOTR:EE);

g) Gandalf rised to Minas Tirith as in FOTR with similar shot as he crests a ridge - but this time he is closer

h) Pippin and palantir is reminiscent of the Moria well/skeleton scene and he gets the same reprimand "Fool of a Took";

i) Sauron's voice says "I see you!" as it did to Frodo at Bree;

j) the elven procession through the woods echoes a similar procession in FOTR:EE seen by Sam and Frodo;

k) we see the Sauron/Isildur clip again;

l) forging of Rings was a theme in FOTR; in ROTK we get reforging of a sword;

m) Osgiliath is seen from afar almost as in FOTR (same sequence as Gandalf arriving at MMT in FOTR);

n) the gargoyles at Minas Morgul with down-turned horns, resemble the balrog from FOTR;

o) in FOTR the shrill cries of the BR's scared the hobbits - in ROTK the calls of the Nazgul or their beast are similar but worse;

p) the fell beasts resemble the firework dragon at Bilbo's party in the way it flies and swoops - I did not notice this resemblance in TTT;

q) in FOTR the BRs emerge from the gates of Minas Morgul, in ROTK it is the Nazgul Lord, and vast legions of orcs;

r) as Frodo is climbing the endless stair, Gollum sees the Ring in the former's open shirt-neck - strongly this reminded me of Bilbo seeing the Ring at Rivendell;

s) Aragorn send Arwen off on a mission by night (to the ford) in FOTR. In ROTK he rides off after a similarly shot dialogue with Eowyn. One scene is an acceptance - of Arwen as an equal, while eowyn is rejected. Both women ride as warriors.

t) Gimli and legolas insisting they will go with Aragorn to POTD is reminiscent of the hobbits insisting on going with Frodo at Rivendell;

u) Aragorn and co are surrounded/encircled by orcs while underground in Moria; in POTD there are similarly encircled by the undead. Finally similar shots at the Black Gate.

v)Faramir is wounded by 2 arrows and survives - he is faithful. Boromir and Isildur who fail the test are killed by three.

x) in FOTR Gandalf arrives in the Shire in an open cart, at the end of ROTK he leaves in a covered one;

y) In FOTR we see how hard it was to kill ONE cave troll, in ROTK they are faced with dozens;

z) when frodo is stung by Shelob his expression parallels that when speared by the troll in Moria;

a1) Shelob's mouth and the mouth of the Watcher outside Moria are similar

b1) on the return to the Shire

in ROTK, the hobbits see the same old hobbit passed by Frodo and Gandalf in FOTR (kids and fireworks sequence)

c1) when Frodo claims the Ring in the Sammath Naur his expression matches that of Isildur when he did the same

d1) back in the Green Dragon in ROTK, Frodo fetches four tankards of ale as he had in FOTR. Once again he raises his tankard in a toast with a similar expression.

e1) Frodo writing in study at end of ROTK, echoes Bilbo working on book at start of FOTR.

f1) the moth appears in conjunction with the eagles in both FOTR and ROTK (but NOT in TTT)

g1) the collapsing walkway in the Sammath Naur echoes the collapsing staircase in Moria;

h1)The hand - Frodo reaches for Sam under water in FOTR/Sam reaches for Frodo on the edge of the walkway in the Sammath Naur.

Some of these will almost certainly be subjective. They may however be of interest to some. I certainly don't recall being as conscious of such parallels between TTT and FOTR.

Also FOTR and ROTK act as "bookends" to TTTT, bracketting it and giving it beginning and ending.

Phyxius

12-31-2003, 03:07 AM

Wow Jess! You've seen it 5 times already?!? OMG! I'm having difficulty myself trying to watch it a second time!!! How does ur parent let you?!?
You are truly a fanatic!

Thanks for the article thingys as well! Very interesting indeed!~

michelle_chou

12-31-2003, 03:08 AM

haha! that's funny stuff! thanx for pointing this stuff out!

Jess

12-31-2003, 03:20 AM

Wow Jess! You've seen it 5 times already?!? OMG! I'm having difficulty myself trying to watch it a second time!!! How does ur parent let you?!?
You are truly a fanatic!

Actually, now I'm reaching the point where I have to beg them to see it more :sweat: But they understand. Since I read the books (before the movies came out) and got into it, and then saw the first movie (and really got into it) and then joined the official fan club or whatever (and really really got into it), they've kinda accepted the fact that there are certain movies that I will see repeatedly no matter what they do, and the LOTR trilogy is one of them. And I've convinced them that you don't get to see these kinda movies in the theater all your life, after these few months, ROTK (the final movie) is going to leave the theaters, and it's not like they're going to be coming back. And the experience from watching it in the theaters is so much more different than seeing it on TV or something, there's not really a comparison, and so it's best to see it while you have the chance!!!

Now I just wish the extended versions will come out in theaters again and I can see them, since I missed out on Trilogy Tuesday :cry:

lil~jo

12-31-2003, 03:25 AM

I've watched the 1st movie, 3 times.
2nd movie 3 times.
and the 3rd movie only once....
I'm planning to watch the 3rd movie again...
and then I want to watch the extended movie for the 3rd movie.
The extension of the 2nd movie was so very funny though!
I want to watch all three movies together*^^*...
It would be so very very looong!...sitting for 10 hours......

Phyxius

12-31-2003, 03:32 AM

Can you jst go watch the extension in the cinema?!? I thought you can only c the extention from buying DVD!!

lil~jo

12-31-2003, 03:43 AM

No, you can't watch the extention in the cinema!
How very sad....thank goodness, I have a home theatre...hehe, that way it is like watching it at the cinema.
It is good fun watching extensions, it somehow makes things a lot clearer.
Cause everything is explained in more detail!

Jess

12-31-2003, 03:50 AM

No no you can't watch the extended versions in theater, but on December 16th, there was something called Trilogy Tuesday.. In preperation for the release of ROTK on Dec. 17th, they brought the FOTR extended and TTT extended back into the theaters, and they showed those two and directly after they showed ROTK. 9 hours of LOTR... that would be heaven :drool: I tried to get tickets to that, but it sold out 15 minutes after they went on sale :cry:

GaryDAI

12-31-2003, 04:00 AM

I'm a huge LOTR fan but I don't think I could sit through that.........My butt would be uncomfortable after 3 hours :oops:

Phyxius

12-31-2003, 04:04 AM

Hmmm.... I would go... But how do they cater you? 9hrs straight without food?!?? Plus i have a weak bladder, so i must sit at the back and at the very end seat to the aisle! Hahaha

cinsin

12-31-2003, 06:52 AM

I went to see it and near the end of the movie, I had to go to the bathroom and I thought the movie was going to end soon but it didn't, it lasted another 45 minutes. I never really saw the end as my tears of pain were blinding me.

There were a few times when the movie got a little boring so I made up my own storyline like all the dialogue scenes. :laughing:

linny

12-31-2003, 06:53 AM

*sigh* It's a shame it's over. I would've tried to get tickets if I could. >.<

Anyway, me and Jess were arguing about this earlier, so I bring it to everyone's attention.

Who is cooler: Merry or Pippin? Why?

I learn more towards Merry because Dominic Monaghan KICKS MAJOR BOOTY! and Jess is a Billy Boyd girl all the way.

ker_ai_teresa

12-31-2003, 07:55 AM

i like Pippin more. he showed great courage and loyalty to Denethor and prevented him from killing himself and Faramir.
plus, he's a good singer and dancer :)

Jess

12-31-2003, 08:40 AM

HIGH-FIVE, TERESA!!!!!! I'm your number one fan now.

Pippin so totally kicks Dom's (or Merry's) ASS!!!!! Seriously. He was loyal to Denethor even though (well, movie-wise) he was treated badly, he saved Faramir's life, stayed by Gandalf's side, he had to experience the pain and horror of the Palantir, and had to go through speaking with Sauron himself, he has a lovely singing voice, and on top of all that?!??! HE'S CUTE!!!!!! Who doesn't love Pippin's laughter and smiles, and then the sad and worn look he later develops. Pippin is the youngest of all four hobbits, and he's so innocent in the beginning, but near the end of the war, he's been through so much, he's basically been forced to grow up... Who doesn't love Pippin's sense of humor?!? And best of all... his ACCENT. If we're talking about Billy Boyd here, he has the best accent in the world, the cutest Scottish accent you could ever hear.

PIPPIN aka BILLY BOYD IS SO MUCH BETTER THAN MERRY aka DOMINIC MONAGHAN!!!

It feels weird to be saying that because you can't really think about Pippin without Merry, and Merry without Pippin, and in that case, Billy without Dom or Dom without Billy. They go together, and without each other, they wouldn't be as funny or happy as they are, and that's one of the reasons why you love them so much. Plus, they're both cute in their own ways :tongue: I must admit Dom is pretty cute in the behind-the-scenes of the Extended FOTR...

Phyxius> They had hour breaks in between. And you could get up anytime you wanted to during the movies because they had assigned seating. So it wasn't THAT bad ^^ They wouldn't force you to sit through a 9 hour movie!!! That's crazy. Even I couldn't handle that. And I have a Bladder of Steel©. Maybe.

Phyxius

12-31-2003, 01:27 PM

I like Pippin more, coz he funny... His accent is funny too! Also he is very loyal to the fellowship and looks up to Faramir, my hero ^^

adnam8

12-31-2003, 01:37 PM

i like pippin more too. he has more of an innocence to him. when i look at merry, i already think that hes up to something ^^;

hey, i didnt know there were hour breaks =\ i wanted to see it, but was worried my butt would go numb. i get a bit restless after just one of the movies.

lil~jo

12-31-2003, 11:40 PM

Haha, if you see Pippin in real life, he still looks innocent! hehe.....really CUTE!

As for Merry, he sometimes can look a bit dumb....but yeah, you're right, he can look as though he is up to something.

ker_ai_teresa

01-01-2004, 01:35 AM

It feels weird to be saying that because you can't really think about Pippin without Merry, and Merry without Pippin, and in that case, Billy without Dom or Dom without Billy. They go together, and without each other, they wouldn't be as funny or happy as they are,

that is so true. the 2 characters just compliment each other so well and that's why Tolkien had them together. they could work off each other and make each other's characteristics stand out more obviously. without Pippin, we wouldn't see Merry as the more responsible and mature one. but without Merry, Pippin's fun-loving nature wouldn't be as pronounced.
also relationships is also very important in LOTR. Pippin and Merry aren't the only pair we see enhance the story, but also Legolas and Gimli. without Legolas, i don't think Gimli would have been as funny and cute a character as he is, coz just the idea of an elf and a dwarf, 2 such different beings, becoming such close friends and allies, is funny.
then of course, there's Frodo and Sam...

so it was really effective how Tolkien took these opposite characters, put them together and then had them develop and learn off each other, and also add more to the story.

Jess

01-01-2004, 05:55 AM

Same with Frodo and Sam. Their relationship is just... wow. THAT to me is the perfect relationship of love and friendship... and not love as in that way, but love as in they're willing to go through whatever just to see each other smile again.

See linny!!! Look at all the Pippin lovers out there :tongue:

linny

01-02-2004, 03:17 AM

:cry: Does no one else in the world like Merry like I do? I suppose their relationship is the kind that you can't really break up. Sam and Frodo's relationship was FANTASTIC! They're so dedicated to each other.

Anyone else have a strange dislike for Denethor? What I'm wondering is should we feel sorry for him like we do for Smeagol/Gollum? Or are his actions (i.e. sending Faramir to his DEATH) justified?

...I always wonder what people feel about that because I know I pity Smeagol because he's gone through so much. Should I then, pity Denethor? He went through a lot too.

lil~jo

01-02-2004, 03:23 AM

I like Merry, I like all the characters is just that we were just discussing on how innocent Pippin looks, compared to Merry.

I like the loyalty between the hobbits.

(Pippin, Merry, Sam and Frodo)

its sweet.

As for smeagol, -> I liked him in the 2nd movie, and I really pityed him there, but in the 3rd, he was so mean, and evil and so unworthy of any pity what so ever!

michelle_chou

01-02-2004, 04:10 AM

As for smeagol, -> I liked him in the 2nd movie, and I really pityed him there, but in the 3rd, he was so mean, and evil and so unworthy of any pity what so ever!

yes i agree completely...smeagol/gollum was too evil for any sympathy in the 3rd movie! i hate how he tricked Frodo into the tunnel n then laughed at him!!! but in the end, he got what he deserved even tho if it wasnt for him, the ring would still have lived on.

cici bebe

01-02-2004, 11:00 PM

I couldn't find myself pitying Denethor, to have been so cruel (or insane?) to the point of sending his last living son to his death (basically, battling orcs when he had almost no chance) and then instructing to burn him (though he was still alive). There was just some kind of evil to Denethor, shown when he was having his meal, this certain ruthlessness. Even to his death, I couldn't sympathize.

The same with Smeagol/Gollum. Especially when Sam caught on to his evil tricks, that disgustingly evil smirk that Smeagol would flash at him behind Frodo's back. And his evil trick to turn Frodo against Sam with the bread. He just made me worse than angry.

Jess

01-02-2004, 11:24 PM

The same with Smeagol/Gollum. Especially when Sam caught on to his evil tricks, that disgustingly evil smirk that Smeagol would flash at him behind Frodo's back. And his evil trick to turn Frodo against Sam with the bread. He just made me worse than angry.

I agree, I couldn't really sympathize with Smeagol/Gollum as much as in TTT, but the last part you spoke about there... In the books, Smeagol/Gollum never tricks Frodo into turning him against Sam :cry: Peter Jackson just added that in, which was pulled off beautifully, by the way, but it just wasn't what Tolkien wrote and it kinda makes Smeagol/Gollum a little more eviler than he was intended to be.

Message for everyone from the man down the street!!!

LOVE DENETHOR!!!

lil~jo

01-02-2004, 11:57 PM

Denethor? why love him?....he nearly murdered his own son!!! ALIVE!!!!
LOVE HIM?
(sorry....I just thought what he did was terribly wrong!)
One thing I liked about the 3rd movie though, was at the beginning they showed an introduction on smeagol and deagol.
It is great that they explained how smeagol killed his friend and became the way he was.

Phyxius

01-03-2004, 12:04 AM

I don't like Denethor too he's one mean king! Killed his son and wants to die with him! Maybe i'll get to like him when i read the book, but at the moment i'm not finished, so i'll stick with unliking Denethor!

gr8t_gal

01-03-2004, 12:06 AM

Denethor? The crazy man who keeps eating chicken with tomatoes and listening to Pippin singing and ends up being a crazy lunatic insane man who wants to burn his son but ends up burning himself instead? That denethor??!!...
Interestingggggg to hear there's a denethor fan. 0_0 (LOL :-P)

Jess

01-03-2004, 12:16 AM

Denethor? why love him?....he nearly murdered his own son!!! ALIVE!!!!
LOVE HIM?
(sorry....I just thought what he did was terribly wrong!)

I say love him because he was miserably portrayed in ROTK!!!! I think of all the characters that Tolkien wrote, Denethor was by far the worst interpreted in Peter Jackson's script.

I'll briefly explain...

How Denethor was in the book:
He was a kind and noble steward. Though he did favor Boromir over Faramir, he didn't go as far as saying it to his face so cruelly. He was extremely nice to Pippin and was courteous to Gandalf ("Mithrandir"). For many, many years he held the place as the steward of Gondor and did his job well, being kind to his people and making wise decisions. And then his wife died. The death of his wife grieved him and he slipped into sorrow. Blinded by his grief, he thought it would be wise to look into the Palantir (one of the lost seven seeing stones, only three had been found and accounted for, one which was in control by Sauron himself and the other had been in the tower of Orthanc, in Isengard, used by Saruman. However, at the beginning of ROTK, Pippin finds it in the water and it falls into possession of Gandalf, and then later into Aragorn's hands) to see what was becoming of Middle-Earth. Sauron deceives him and uses his trickery to manipulate Denethor - he shows Denethor images that had not yet come to pass, and some that weren't altogether true. The steward becomes more and more troubled, and his outlook on life rapidly worsens. Sauron continues feeding him misinformation, that Aragorn was going to come and take over his throne, that Rohan was going to abandon him in war, that King Theoden was going to betray him... and once he discovered the death of Boromir, he lost total control of his life. I think he truly did believe that Faramir was dead, so blinded by what was happening around him, that he chose to have them both burn on the pyre. But even his death was taken from him and changed in the movie - in the book, he died nobley by burning on the pyre of Gondor and holding his Palantir in his hands.

How Denethor was in the movie:
He was a selfish, unwise ruler. He rejected Gandalf's advice and was bitter to Pippin. Mourning over the loss of his son, he chose to be terrible to all under his rule. They don't show that he looked into the Palantir and thus became who he was near the end of his rule. He forces his youngest son, Faramir, into a suicide ride and says harsh lines such as, "Yes... I wish that..." and "That will depend on the manner of your return." When Faramir returns, being dragged by his own steed, Denethor believes him to be dead and stumbles away and looks out over his kingdom to see Sauron's army attacking his city of Minis Tirith. He goes into a long, "annoying" speech of how "Rohan has deserted me..." "Theoden has betrayed me..." and orders his soldiers to abandon their posts. He is then taken out by Gandalf, which never happened in the books. Then, he decides that it's time to burn him and his son alive. He takes Faramir, who twitches a lot to show that he's alive, to the pyre and sets him upon it and pours oil over him and himself. When hindered, he cruelly throws out Pippin and releases him from his service and tells him that he can die "in whatever way seemed best." Pippin runs off to find Gandalf and Gandalf bursts in on Shadowfax and knocks Denethor off of the pyre with his spear, and Pippin rescues Faramir. Denethor attempts to harm Pippin because he somehow believes that his son was being taken away from him, and Gandalf's horse shoves him into the fire. Denethor starts burning, and, on fire, hops down from the pyre and runs off the cliff screaming. So passes Denthor, the steward of Gondor.

Which one seems better?!