Effects of Immigration = Loss of Culture???

[ViBi]

just thought of this topic after reading another thread from small talk...

well, i immigrated from hong kong to australia when i was 9 years old.. and because i couldnt speak any english, i didnt feel as if i fitted in and hence, tried to westernise myself as much as possible for a while... like, i didnt feel that learning chinese was important etc etc... but then, thank the heavens, after a while, i found myself and began to realise the importance of my ethnicity and began embracing the chinese culture once again and worked very very hard to improve my chinese...

but despite that, because i do live in a western country, i have found that many tradition chinese customs have been lost in my family...as it is more difficult to keep up all traditions.. for example, this year, i am spending my first chinese new year in hong kong in about 9 years... i have found that besides the well known traditions of receiving red pockets and "bai nin" (visiting relatives to wish them well for the new year), i didnt know many other things... for example, i didnt know the meaning of the many different flowers people put in their homes because you simply cant get all those flowers in australia...

my point is that, has immigration given me the best of both worlds or has it left me being incomplete, neither western or eastern?? i have known many chinese people who have lost their identity after immigration, either refusing to be chinese or refusing to speak english... i mean, in australia, i feel very asian, yet back in hong kong, i feel a little caucasian... i guess, my question to you is that, does immigration hurt culture? and i think many of you in this forum are also american-chinese or similar, so does any of you have similar experiences as me???

[ladiebugfreak]

I was born here, in america and I know I have very little chinese in me culturally. My chinese is so bad that I can't even communicate with my grandmother, who came here to visit, and I feel ashamed that I don't know anything. I've grown so used to talking to my parent in English that even if I were to try to speak in chinese: 1) It'll be so heavily accented that they probably couldn't understand me --;; 2.) It's just be weiirddd.

I think it's awesome that you know both worlds and I think you should find yourself very lucky ^^. I think that you should identify yourself as both a western and eastern person. I mean, why pick?

I think immigration does have an effect on culture loss. Ex. Me. My mother came from taiwan and dad malaysia. Me, America, only fluent in english, no knowledge of culture (Tis verry bad, i know, and totally regretting how I just brushed off chinese school like that.)

Yea. So... I'm obviously westernized.

[eiko]

this is a very interesting topic.....
i agree that immigration does make ppl lose their culture, i immigrated from china to the us when i was like 9 too, and i agree that it is sooo very hard to fit in this place, i had to take esl and everything else that was thrown at me.
i started to lose my mandarin as i got good at english, i always speak to my brother and sister in english and to my parents, they want us to speak to them in fuzhou dialect(fuzhou is where im originally from) because they said they dont want us to forget who we really are
i think wat kept me connected the the asian culture is my love for movies lol i loved watchin the movies and it really helped me to start speakin mandarin again and it helped me learn to read in chinese too because i like to read the subtitles, after a few years in the us made me lose all those things untill i gained them back
now i even read the chinese newspaper (cuz of jay really) jay's music got me going for azn culture too
my brother who was a yr or two younger than me when my family moved here, lost all his mandarin, he was all american but after we started to listen to jay, he now actually knows how to sing some of the song! lol
well im proud to say that im azn, i dont want to be westernized even though i live in the western world, theres this girl at my school who just moved to the us like 2 yrs ago, she has perfect english because she took english lessons in taiwan, i thought she would be very...azny but she wasnt, she doesnt listen to "our" music, or watch our movies and everything else, i can understand that shes trying to fit in but you cant let that ruin your culture and you definitely cant forget who u really are......

[panda_shine]

Hmm interesting topic :happy:

I can totally understand where you are coming from too^^.

I immigrated to Canada when I was 6 years old.. and back then, I knew very few people who spoke Cantonese and those who did weren't very good. Due to that, I was always so eager to learn English and I wanted to become more westernized so I could fit in with the other kids. I guess it didn't really take me that long to do that and in the end, I sorta succeeded.

I guess the 'loss of culture' thing didn't really hit me until I went to high school and I found that there a lot of the groups/cliques/labels. I found myself not really knowing where I belong because there were the 'Hongers', who didn't see me as a Honger since I rarely spoke Cantonese at school and somehow I felt so out of place with Caucasians .. but over the years, somehow I just found myself again. I decided that like some people said, why chose whether you are more Westernize or Chinese because I believe the most important thing is being yourself. I have to admit I am more Westernized than Chinese but I have not forgotten my roots and I still keep connected with my roots. =)

[trishee]

I think its more like "Diversity of Culture"
I really cant relate to you guys that much, I got an early english education outside of thailand while my parents spoke thai to me. I moved back to Thailand for first grade, and so my foundation for both english and thai is pretty strong.

Yeah sure, immigration can result to loss of culture, I think its the duty of the parents or guardians or whatever to make sure the next generation actually knows and appreciates their ethnicity.

Some people are in denial and thats just annoying and incredibly arrogant. My best friend has an Indian cousin who lived in Ohio for many years of her life. This cousin says she isnt Indian, she says she is "Ohioian". :rasp:

[zhy378]

hmm..yeah i think the effects of immigration does lose some culture.
like my parents r from china, but when they got to here america, they gotta change soemwhat to fit here, right. like now they gotta get used to american's way, like the ways of raisin their kids which is quite different compared how they were raised back in china.

then there's the kinda confusion for the kids of immigrants, take me for an example, here i might be too chinese but if i go to china i mght be too american, so is like im in between, whether i should stick becoming westernized as i celebrate less chinese traditions cuz i know when i have kids , they wont have that much culture i have experience. or should i continue the traditions. oh well, we'll see.... :whistle:

[cool181]

yes...i think that immigration will effects the culture......since when u already at there..u use to live/stay your life with those ppl at there....

beside that i think that....children also should study what kind of school depend on their religion to understand more deeply about the same religion history.....
eg...like me i'm chinese & my whole family also knew chinese as well (include read& write) since small...but me are the one odd ppl who study other language school.....so is always make me feel i'm different from them.....sometimes will ask why i'm so odd??

[scarletwillow]

I myself am a Chinese (mainland) citizen living in the United States for over 12 years.
I see my fellows around me, who have lost their culture and their sense of self, and I pity them.

You can throw away who you are, that's fine.
You'll just lose respect.

I once met a 14 year old Chinese kid whose grandmother had died.
His family is Buddhist, but he claims himself Christian.
When his family lit incense for his grandmother, he refused to touch it.

Idiocy.

[pyro_sign]

^ That's.. sad. :/


But yeh.
I guess it really depends on the person and their choices. I was born in the US and somehow my first language was Khmer. All my friends that have immigrated from a different country don't leave behind their culture. They're not fobs or anything; they just keep in touch. And then the ones who haven't immigrated, like me, are still immensly in tune with theirs. I guess it's because they decided to keep that part of themselves. I've seen other people at my school who don't know a single word of their ethnicity's language and their parents are immigrants. They chose to be like that. They missed out.

;x

[vicks]

I'm like pyro_sign. I was born in the US, but personally I feel very in touch with the Chinese culture. I'm not saying I know everything about it, but I don't deny where I'm from. It does depend on the person because I went through a phase where I really didn't want to be considered Chinese, but now I'm trying to learn all I can about the Chinese culture and actually all Asian cultures.

There definitely is a push for immigrants to "fit in", at least in the US and as a result, the 2nd generation kids tend to lose a lot of their culture. I dont' think that's necessarily bad. It does scare me reading about the situation that Scarletwillow wrote about. That's just denying your own family!

[ker_ai_teresa]

I once met a 14 year old Chinese kid whose grandmother had died.
His family is Buddhist, but he claims himself Christian.
When his family lit incense for his grandmother, he refused to touch it.

But that's to do with religious choice not necessarily because he has lost touch with his ethnic roots.
Yes, it is a part of the Chinese culture to pay respect to the deceased by lighting incense and bowing, but you can't accuse him of being disrespectful to his culture and grandmother because he chose to stand by his religious beliefs. And by the same token, you can't judge whether someone is being genuinely respectful because they've carried out those actions.

Perhaps your friend could have approached the situation with a different attitude and responded differently, because Christianity doesn't state that one can't pay their respects to deceased family members who are Buddhists. I don't know this guy, but judging from his age and depending on how long he has been a Christian, he probably just didn't know any better hence, didn't deal with things in a more sensitive manner.

anywayz, back to the topic at hand.
I'm Chinese myself but have lived most of my life in Australia. Yes immigration can result in loss of culture and language, but that depends on the individual. Some ppl choose to immerse themselves in their original culture by living in their own ethnic communities where the need to function in English is minimal. While others (mostly those educated in their new country) choose to conform to the culture, and this can be done to varying degrees. I know friends who are so desperate to be "Australian", force themselves to use Aussie slang and follow Aussie traditions. Some people just feel the need to be accepted and to fit in.

As for myself, I'm probably somewhere in the middle. I still speak Cantonese at home and although I can't read and write fluently, but hey, I've tried to learn. I have Chinese friends whom I speak Chinese and English with, and I also have Caucasian friends. I can cook Chinese dishes but if you want a steak or Italian pasta, I could do that too. I admit, I'm ignorant when it comes to certain Chinese traditions, but that's what happens when you live in a western country, people don't make a big deal about certain festivals and celebrations anymore.

anyway, I don't feel that immigration is necessarily a bad thing. Yes, you do lose some of your 'mother culture' but you also gain knowledge of other cultures at the same time. As for self identity, that, I feel is up to the individual. You have to find your own identity and accept it. It's what you feel comfortable with.

Some people have tried to argue with me on the topic of my identity. They say I should call myself Vietnamese because I was born there. But I say 'no', I'm Chinese-Australian. My heritage is Chinese but it's now infused with some Australian culture and values, for which I am proud of.

[ShuiMei]

I think it really depends on how you look at it, sure it could seem like you're losing your culture, but it could also seem like you're gaining another culture. For example a Chinese person who immigrates to France may leave behind certain cultural aspects but in turn will be adopting characteristics from a new culture, almost like an exchange ^^

We are human beings and we will change according to our surroundings to survive, adopting the culture of where you live is natural and unavoidable. However, how much you adopt and hold on to will vary. As a Canadian, I think immigration is great. Canada is a country built on immigration, but with that we haven't been able to create a solid cultural identity. Personally, I think Canadian culture is the amalgamation and adoption of other cultures into a great cultural mosiac- the first country of the global world.

My view may be different though since I am a Chinese born in Canada, but I think essentially it is rather similar. Linguistically, my Cantonese is terrible and I can't read or write. I also find myself clashing with the social values and mentality of my parents, but in turn my values and importance of family is very different from my Anglo-saxon Canadian peers. I also don't listen to English music anymore or dress like most people my age. I am not familiar with what I like to call "English food" as my family still eats a Chinese style dinner basically every night, and I don't understand their strange fasincation with things like "Greese" and "Dirty Dancing." I am definitely not very "Chinese" but I am FAR FAR FAR from a typical westernized teenager.

It may seem like I'm in limbo, but like my balance between the two cultures, it took me a long time to find out where I was headed and which "side" I wanted to lean on, but I think I'm happiest where I am now :)